Hello, my friends, and welcome to the next episode of uncomplicating business with I know yet another one of my very favorite people. I was actually sitting outside with the dog this morning trying to think about how long I have known her. And it has been ages I feel like and I think it goes back to like, pre covid, even maybe, like kids were little, and it's been a long time. 

So I first, Hi, I'm Sara, and I am a business coach. I'm the creator of selling for weirdos. I help people simplify all the things. So if you're tangled up, let's untangle it. This is my my one of my very favorite people on the internet, my dear friend, Georgia Mullis, and she is a money coach, and she thinks a ton about the helpers and the healers and the people you know who you are, the people who under charge, the people who would happily help themselves into a hole, right? Because they're like, I'll do that for $5 and who feel bad about asking for money, because you it's the same thing that I end up talking about structurally, which is, like, you think you're either helping or charging, but you can't be doing both, and that feels conflicted. It is like you have a price, but nobody actually pays it. 

You know. You know who you are, right now. You're like, damn it. I don't want to listen to this. I don't want to be here. I It's like my kid. When I took her to see inside out too. When it's like the teenager, and she was 12, she kept trying to go to the bathroom. I was like, sit down, because she felt so seen. It's the people who want to make everything affordable, like in quote, unquote, because affordable is value judgment, and they're trying to make it as low as possible, who are really conscious of money and being kind to other people and also not not connected to their value. She is all about helping you change that ethically with you know, connection to having is not a bad thing, and so you can do the things you want to do and not feel like a terrible person, which is pretty important, friend. It's so nice to see you. Thank you for coming to visit me today.

Thank you for having me. I feel, I feel so grateful to you on a regular basis. Oh, I you. And I think this is the the wonderful thing about when someone is just who they are and just is consistent. And I don't like that word. I honestly despise, despise that word, so I don't mean it as in consistent. I mean you are consistently you, thank you, and you have been consistently you for such a long time, and have helped me through completely unknowingly. So many you know of those dips we get in business. So, so thank you, thank you for having me.

Oh, my goodness, okay, there's no crying on the podcast. That's rude. That's like, no, yeah, it is. I always say to people like, this is the only person I know how to be. I'm really bad at being everybody else, so I might as well just show up as myself terrible being other people. So we are going to keep talking about trust. I know the people in my world are like, Oh my God again. But here's the thing for me, what I realized at some point last year is that basically everything rolls back to it. Right? You're going to have a different perspective of it, but it like nothing. Everything rolls back to it. If we're not working from trust, that's why things aren't working. It is what it is. So for you, what does it mean to trust yourself? What does it mean to trust your business? How do you define trust in your day to day? What does that look like?

I've been in thinking about this, and I have had a really difficult relationship with trust, real, normal, right? All of us, all right. And, you know, there's always so many different, different reasons for it, but, but the season I'm in now, it is what trust can trust is the opposite of self abandonment.

Oh, that's good. Say Say it again and then say more
trust is the opposite of self abandonment.

Okay, so tell people what you mean when you say self abandonment. So.
This is something that it has become clear now
through so many different situations, through so many different years, through professional, through personal, through friendship groups that the world really desires your self, abandonment, your loved ones, especially. And you know, I'm speaking as a cis het woman. You know I've I'm past 45 now you do write a significant you know, significant portion of my life was my self abandonment. Was desired and rewarded by my partner, by my kids, by my corporate role. And there is only so long you can continue to do that before there are serious consequences for health, for relationships, and for me, that's it. Really was this moment when I realized, you know that I trusted other people sometimes, you know establishments more than I trusted myself.

Yes, well, and I think what you're talking about is sort of the social pressure and structures built so that everybody is before us. Yeah, yep, and our businesses and the particularly for women, the the weird pressure to like self deprecate and not have your own back.

Yes, self deprecate, not have your own back. Outsource, outsource, self belief, and so the trust, for me, the trust wasn't the first choice. The first choice was to, oh, okay, if this feels like self abandonment, what could a different choice be? Right? And my my boundaries. Mentor was like, you know, the stepping stone to self trust is, could be just respect, self respect well, and it is the like, the noticing and the acknowledgement right, that self respect is the acknowledgement that you too matter, and maybe you don't put into action the things that right? Maybe the first action isn't to put yourself first because that feels like a mountain. Yes, it is to say, wait, I belong in this equation too, right? Yes, and that was really, really the place that I came back. I came into this probably, like a decade ago. Was, huh, this needs to include me. Yeah, this equation, you just needs to include me. And then, you know, then you're on a journey, right?

Yeah. In the best and worst ways, right? Where you're like, what, where is the map? Who made it like a pirate map? What happened here
and the the guides aren't you have to realize who's not a true guide, who is a pirate.

Oh, and a couple of people who I've talked to for the podcast have come to this like there is self trust, and then there is the trust in yourself to be able to evaluate other people's trustworthiness, which is what you're talking about here. It's like having enough trust in yourself to be able to be like, You know what? They're not trustworthy. Because that, in itself, in and of itself, is an act of trust that we're not taught to do. Right to be able to be like their opinion is not going to rank here.
That's for so many different reasons. And if we look at it within, you know, female relationships, female friendships, you know, you know, there is the you know, women need to have other women's backs, right? And then it's okay. But I've met those women, you know, I've been around those women for long enough to know that, you know, there's something hinky going on here, that or not all relationships, not all, not everyone, has done sufficient work in understanding, you know, internal patriarchy, internal misogyny, you know, withholding, holding. Up behaviors and standards that actually are not in our own internal best interest.
Yeah, well, it's interesting. 

I was talking to someone yesterday that I like. It was a connection call, right? I do it. I love the people part of this, right? So talking to this woman, you're so good well, but as she I was talking to her, she was like, You're so natural at this. I was like, this was a skill I built this. This is a skill. This was not nature, not my default setting. But she and I were talking yesterday about, like, one of the things I do in my house is we talk to the kids all the time, but we don't do casual meanness. We don't do casual meanness not to each other, not to other people, not out in the world. We don't do it. It's not okay. Like I am not good with casual meanness as a human being. I'm not good with other people treating you that way, or you treating them that way. And it is that casual meanness between women, I think sometimes between people who feel like they're in competition. Yeah, it's so hard.

Yes, you know what? You have just put a name to something that I have discussed with my family about something that we don't do, and it the best name we had for it is in the UK banter, okay? But it's not banter. It's saying really cruel things in a way that makes it okay to say them, because it's a joke. Yeah, it's casual, yeah, casual meaning, right? And I that that is such a, such a much better description of the actual activity, right? And it was really interesting. My one of my kids had a party in the summer, and she had three different groups of friends, and there was different threads that that pulled on the friendships, right? So there were, you know, there was enough people in each group that they were comfortable with each other, and no one was left out. And, you know, there was good cross connection, yeah? Because there were some really amazing kind of connector type personalities who who took on that role of hosting, right? But one of the things that my kid really noticed afterwards, she was like, that group, they're mean to each other. They are consistently mean to each other, as if it's a joke, and like it's not okay, because the that's back to the that's breaking trust in themselves and each other that we bring it into business. It's like breaking trust between colleagues. It's breaking trust between it's like, it's not okay. We don't, we don't treat people like that.

And and there is that almost demand that we treat ourselves like that, self depreciating to you you know, and I speak, I speak with one of my coaches a lot about this, like, you know, I have a, you know, one of my biggest values, actually, one of my top five values is a sense of humor, right? And I take my business very seriously, yep. And I can, I can enjoy things being and myself being extremely funny, well and you it's the old adage of like, we can take the work seriously, but not ourselves, right? Like it can be fun, and if you work with trust, it is fun because you're not spinning around the nonsense of, like, is that how they wanted me to do it? Is it good enough? Does it compare? Will they be mean about it? Like, man, wow. Whatever. Right it is. And like my I started as a middle school teacher, my like, default setting is sarcasm, like it is. It's like some mom at baseball the other day said to me, what inning is it? And I said, 73 like, 152 right? Like, I cannot give a straight answer to that question, because it always feels like 400 and I love it, and it's fun, but it's never, I mean, good God, so like, and she just looked at me. They don't know me real well yet, because it's even she was like, Huh, oh,
hold on. Oh, you're funny.

That took her a whole second, and then she was like, Oh, well, it was also 8am but whatever. But it like, that's allowed, yeah. And that's part of trusting who we are. Like if you're funny, if you're sarcastic, if you're who you are, you do that, but you don't have to be mean while you're doing it. No.
And that meanness to ourselves. So, so, so self, like I said, you know this stepping stone, the thing that is. Yes, for me, is, is it has the kind of the glow about it that I recognize before I go, Oh, okay, what could trust? What could self trust look like? It's going, Oh, that's the glow of self abandonment. Okay, that's, it's got a glow. It's got a smell, right? It smells. And you're like, Ah, okay.

And it's something that it's been really interesting seeing it come up with, with clients who, you know, I work, I absolutely love, you know, the way you're, you're the niche the tagline has, you know, has evolved. I work with therapists. Help us the you know, they have spent years getting really, quite, quite significant, very meaningful qualifications, yep, and that that is not to dismiss anyone who doesn't do that, but they have done that. They are allowed to take themselves seriously. They are allowed to take their skills. No, not just allowed they should. Yes, you know that that the there is, you know, I feel like there is, you know, there is a requirement to not dismiss the value that they bring and the work that has gone on gone into doing that work, it wasn't just like a snap of their fingers, and they know a lot, and it makes a huge difference. And then for them to be like, well, $5 you're like, nope, nope, nope.

Do you know what one of one of my clients, when she was, she was, you know, she put, she had, she had put her prices up, you know, 5% you know that that one gonna put my prices up? You know, you can't tell me I haven't put my prices up because I have 5% and one of her colleagues went, That's bold, right, right, you
know? And I said to a client the other day, she said, Well, I increased the hourly rate that I'm charging everybody $10 and I was like, why? Like, why are we doing this, like this? And she was like, What do you mean? And I was like, debt, no. And I was like, No, we're not. Like, we No, no. Like, why are we doing because, like, Oh my gosh. And actually, the woman I go to for massage every periodically, like, made a big deal on email one day about, like, raising her rates $5 and I went in, and I was like, Girl, I love you. Knock it off. It should be 25 and stop it. And she was like, what?

I had the exact same conversation with my dog groomer, who is just the most one, the most beautiful human being two, is able to handle these wrangle, these absolute, you know, demented mutts that I have, right? And as does everybody else, because everyone goes so good with I have, I have two chihuahuas crossed with toy poodles.

Oh, all right, right, right. I feel like the Labrador is the most chilled baby, right? It's just like, oh, bathe me, oh, brush me. Oh, do my nails. Like the Labrador is the most chilled thing. The chihuahuas cross with toy poodles. They got views, right? They got, they got, they got opinions.

Yes, views, and she's, and she's, I said, right, have the prices gone up. And she went, Oh, they're gonna go up by two pounds in October.

Oh, I love you, but you gotta value, this is trust. You gotta value yourself more before we move on, though. So, yeah, I'm gonna go back a step, because I think it matters. The way you're talking about, the way you define this, like it occurs to me is like, in like, almost a step stage, because I think there's actually four stages in it. I think there's noticing, self abandonment, I think there's self respect. And I think the one we didn't call out was self kindness, yes, and then self trust, yeah, right, because I think you're really talking about that self kindness we didn't really call out, but it's in there, and it's after the respect, because if you don't have the respect, you can't do the kindness. Yes, and with the kindness comes the trust, right? Like, I think that really so people are like, Oh, respect, but you can't be respecting yourself and be mean.

Yes, it would. It is very difficult to do the same, to do them both at the same time, yeah, you might have a little bit of push. Pool, because it's an, it's a a new skill, yeah, right, because that's not what we're taught to do. That self awareness is wicked hard, right?

So, so we, I think we can have a little bit of that to kind of go, Okay, this is what self respect feels like, Okay? And then absolutely, the kindness. Oh, my Goodness me. What would kindness look like? And, you know, I was listening to this poet the other day talk about, like, the gentleness that we could have with our bodies, because they, you know, they have been there for us, right? They are doing their very best, you know, and maybe we could just be kind, you know, we could be kind to our hands. We could, we could be gently applying our STEM, yeah, instead of, like, just get it done, you know, yeah. Maybe we could just just say thank you, you know, the, you know, I'm just, I've just crossed my arms, and I'm just kind of stroking. And I think that kindness is, you know, it's the softer side, isn't it, of
respect, but I think it comes either in parallel with or almost just like a beat after, yeah, right, because the right spec has to occur to you, but then you have to be kind to it, like you can't keep it without the kindness. But it's interesting. Okay, so I have to, so I think this is I know, because you and I both know that this like trust journey is so inextricably linked, like between personal and business. Yes, but do you think there have been stages where you had to practice trust as a business owner different than a human, or is it always the same?

I what I believe in my bones is that the business forces you to trust before you would be ready as a human.
Yes, that's awful and super true. Oh my gosh, yes, yes.
I think you know, business is a rapid deployment, right? Businesses are vehicles to speed up change and growth well, and it is the like, if you feel like you're ready, you're late, yeah, and that is just lovely and terrible, because that means you never feel ready for anything, and you're like, uncomfortable all the time, but with good reason,

Yes, yes, and, and the business doesn't allow you. Some people, it does it okay. And I know wonderful people that have closed businesses because the wounds from trusting badly were not they were not over, able to overcome, yep, right? We all, we all know, yep, there's people, right. If you can overcome it, then the, you know, again, the vehicle of the business is the thing going, Okay, well, you had your moment, you made a mistake, and now we're done with that,
because we got things to do.

We got things to do. And you know, the oxygen to a business, a business is money, yep, and you cannot sit in a state of grief over mistakenly trusting a person, a situation, a software, a concept, because we need to move on
well. And I think I would, I would add that, I think in so many cases, initially, the the trust wasn't a mistake, right, like it just evolved. Something changed, something evolved. Something shifted with you or with them, or with the software or the program or the idea, and they diverged, yeah, and then you have to adjust. I mean, it is okay.

I'm I'm pulling this right moment, right, because that is why you are such a phenomenal coach, huh? Yes, because that is the Yes. That is the reframe that people need when they're sat, going, how do I overcome this?
Oh, yeah, thank you. Because it is, you know, it's like you didn't, it's, it's something evolved, something shifted. That wasn't like a you trusted the guy who had a stamp on his forehead that said untrustworthy, right? Like, no, everybody saw it. But you like, that's not generally how it works. This is not a cartoon, but it is, you know what, as you were talking what I think about is, I think sometimes one of the things that has informed so much of how I do business, is and, and this is just true for me. Maybe it applies with you. Also is children.

Oh, they're amazing well, because I think they also live in the like, okay, that got messed up. You gotta do something next. Teaching is the same, like, you can't those kids are coming back. They're going to be staring at you. They want another snack. Kids and campers, like, the next meal is coming. So like, that one didn't work. We got to do something else again. You know this, there's, you know, the big, this big white heart, and you know this experience, you know, I have, you know, seen situations where even the kids couldn't pull the person back, yeah, oh, right. However, for me, I've got four and they are wonderfully grounded.
They don't know any other way. I don't know any other way. They're wonderfully grounded. And, you know, we have a culture in our family of, you know, honesty, and that includes them. To me, sometimes you wish they were a little less truthful, right? You're like Guys, why did you I mean, okay, okay, fine, but I do think it is that, like the lessons of all right, move on. Like do the next thing.

 No, you were not ready to bring that human home to live in your house. Holy cow, a human lives in your house now. Like nobody's ready for that. Never. And then they talk back. And then, you know, my daughter is turning 14 this month. I don't what I feel like it. I don't. 13 was fine. 14 feels like I'm broken, having some sort of brain static about it I don't understand so I it is, but it is that learning to trust for me, the way I think about it, is choosing to move forward before the evidence, yes, yeah. Business requires that of us yes in a way that other things don't.
The ability to make decisions based on the information in front of us is key to how successful you're going to be in the next 90 days, in the next 180 days in the
30 years. Right?

Like there are, again, you know there are people that I've seen that, and I get why they hesitate. But you know that muscle of making a decision? You know that the the trust muscle, the the opposite of self, abandoned muscles. Yep, the more you, the more you lean into that, the sooner more rapid, easier results that you want are going to be well.

And I think when we talk about decision making, what I think people get tied up into is making the right decision. But I think all the time, about like, all I have to do is make the decision as right as I can right now, yeah, like, and then I have to be willing to change it, and that's okay, but all I'm going to do is decide. And I think the the connection for me and self abandonment is, for me, the self abandonment is un deciding, a decision I've made, okay, right? It's the like, I decided we're going to do it like this for three weeks, or I've decided this is how I'm going to try this thing for 90 days or whatever. And when I undecided that and stop doing it because I get scared or uncomfortable or some input comes in, it's like, no, no. That's me not having my own back because I made a decision, yeah, and now it is up to me to hold my hand, my own hand, as I. Continue that decision forward, right? The self abandonment comes in when we're like, trying to undecided and read, re adjudicate those decisions, when they don't have any business being redecided, they've already been decided.

I talk about this with my people, and it's, it's, how can we not flinch?
Oh, yes, that's such a good way to explain that.
Yep. And, and that can be, you know, you don't flinch because you're in a container that's going to hold you up against it, yeah. And that can, that can be, you know, there's so many different versions of what that container can look like, but it, it's having someone to remind you. And sometimes we've got to be that person for ourselves, right? And that is it. And sometimes we get that information from a podcast.

Sometimes we get it from like, the person you went to high school with that is like, Are you kidding me? Could you stop it? You're like, whoops.
There I went. Do you know, I got a really, Sara, no email, and I was like, oh, oh, this means it's working. Oh, yeah. Well, it means it's working.
There is a woman who I followed for a long time, and what she says all the time is, like, your job is to move someone to a feeling, but you don't get to decide what feeling that is, yeah, and like, yeah, as they say, nobody likes it, but haters are a good sign, right?

And I think for me, it was, and don't get me wrong, the first time I read it, i My heart sank. My little Yeah, my little RSD went, yeah. You know, the wind was knocked out of my Sara. But you know, we're, we've been in this for a decade, you know, for about 30 seconds, right?

Yep, well, and then you're like, contextualized. Then it got contextualized, and you put it in the context of, like, whether or not that person was trustworthy, yeah, whether or not you needed to adjust. And then you move on.
But also, Hey, you said you wanted to to you said that it was really important for you to become more visible with this, okay, well, when people stop saying no, that's that is an indicator that that success metric is starting to be met, right?
Well, and I say to it's interesting, I say to so many people that come out of teaching have that reflex that everybody has to come along. Yeah, right. Because in a classroom, everybody has to come along. Like I didn't get to pick and choose which kids learned algebra. It All. It had to be all of them. And I didn't get to pick and choose who was in the room, let me tell you. 

But in business, if somebody doesn't want to come along, that's okay, yeah, like it doesn't have to. I think we make it mean that we're doing it wrong, when, in fact, it means we're doing it right. Because we can't be for everybody. I don't got that kind of time. Neither do you.

No, and again, I think that's it's that, oh, not allowing someone's no to cause yourself abandonment. They come back to. And if we're going to look at that in the in the, you know, positive way, it's okay, you know, not allowing that person's no to diminish your trust in yourself, yes, well, when you can hear them and still trust yourself. You can do both.

I, I wanted to put that in bold and underlined. And, you know, sort of, you know, the font that kind of comes out at you, like the Yelly one, the one that pops on your done, yes, like, I think that is it. As long as you you know you are using consent based practices and you are kind, you can you can say thank you, and and and again. For me, what really touched me was my God, this person actually, like felt moved to write an email. And again, we know in business that most people will just ignore stuff if they're not interested. So again, I thought, you know, this is actually a really kind thing this person has done, because they have been very clear about the answer, and that is actually incredibly generous feedback, Yep, yeah, as taking time and effort, and I'm very, very grateful for that, but it is, again, like I said, How do we not flinch?

That's Yes. That's like going on the mental sticky note right here. It's also on the real sticky note over here. I love a sticky note. So the question is, what are, what is the what is your work right now in trust?

Yeah, so for me, it is really focusing on, what could trust look like in this situation? What could self trust look like in this situation? And my shorthand for that is, what would a goddess do? Oh, yes,

I literally. I was in a session like a month ago, and I kind of had gotten myself to that point where I I felt a lot of things moving. You know, when you're in a session and it's like, oh, we're cutting through all the noise, yep. And I just went, what would a goddess do?

No, she doesn't have time for all the nonsense. That is for sure.
I ever since then, I have walked out of rooms I'm no longer interested in being in. I have been clear and kind, because kindness, again, is one of my top values. You know, none of this comes with meanness or cruelty or rudeness. It it is. Goddess doesn't sit for this well, and it's the like, it's the Brene Brown. Clear is kind. Kind is clear. It is the the kindest thing I can do to somebody is say, hey, this doesn't work for me, and here's why. Like a client said to me the other day she sent out a proposal for a higher rate. She was like, what if they say no? And I was like, well, if they say no, what you say to them is, okay, how do we change the scope of work then, because I'm doing this amount of work, yeah, and, and she was like, oh, oh, oh. And I was like, right, they don't have to raise the rate, but if they don't raise the rate, you change the work like it's one or the other. It's not neither or both.

Yeah, again, your people are so lucky to have you, right? And it's, it's, I am obsessed with my work. You know, when you're just obsessed, right? I'm obsessed with my work. I'm obsessed with my clients, like I just, I get goofy thinking about the things that, are you? Like, yes, yeah. Like, it's so exciting. Like, it's so exciting. It's exciting watching them. It's exciting listening to them, it's exciting seeing how they really shed all the stuff that isn't there well and gosh, wouldn't that be nice to like? Imagine how much lighter we'd all feel if we let the stuff that doesn't belong to us go even just the like, day to day nonsense, I said to somebody yesterday, well, that's actually not a me thing, so I can't help you with that. Hey, actually, I think I was that is like, I'm sorry. That's not my department. You'll have to speak to the other Torpey. I don't handle I like that.

So, so, yeah, so, so it's, it's really interesting because, you know, it really does depend on the client. I've got some clients that are coming in, and they are, can, you know this from, from working with people, you know, some of them at the very, very beginning of their business, right? Yep. And it is getting the real nuts and bolts sorted of, you know, and I've actually supported some teachers who've left schools and set up as tutors, right? Yep, and that is just such an enormous it's such an enormous change in who is paying the bills and who is the user.
And there is a whole I have lots of people who tutor in my world, and there's a whole thing to get through about how much people are willing to pay to support their kids that they don't understand.

Yes, again, goosebumps, right? Absolutely. You know, it's such enormous and what comes through is so much family stuff for these people. It's, you know, rates that their mum charged when they were doing work 2030, years ago. It's glass. There is So, you know, real family stuff really starts to kind of take over. Yeah. My absolute focus is getting these people, you know, with cash flow businesses, getting paid before services happen. Because what I noticed was they started the business and they go, Okay, I'll invoice you at the end of the month. Oh, no, yeah,
no, yeah, yeah. Into a package, into a package format that, like, works for actually, I say to people assign, it's gotta, it's got to work for them. And you it can't just work for them.

No, all of this, all of it. So, so it's, you know, that's enormous, you know, that's enormous fun, because it's, you know, all of if you can get stuff right at the beginning, you know, within a couple of months they got just, really, they've got businesses that really have replaced their their income, right? Yeah, you know, and that is, that's a phenomenal place to be as a business owner, because it's just quite a few years to get to that point, right? So that's super fun. And then on the other side, I've got people that, you know, they're kind of a year, five, six, yeah. So they're so established, they've done such and again, like we said, businesses, my God, they make you work, don't they well and so talk, wait before you go, before we do this. Tell me when you think about those two separate groups of people, right? Then, right at the beginning, newbie, baby business and the Been there, done that. What is their overlapping in the Venn diagram? Trust issue?

Oh, okay, that's such a good question. Okay, so immediately, on the other side is they don't have a trust muscle yet. The new ones, Yep, yeah, and they have, they're jaded. Their trust muscle is jaded, right? So that's the outside of the Venn diagram. Okay, what they've got in the middle, I think, is a trust that this could work.
Belief, right? Yeah, belief, belief. And, as my friend Stacey calls it capital K, knowing, yeah, yeah. Oh, I just got goosebumps. Oh yeah, there, there is that. And it's not idealistic, no, we're not talking about that. It's and it's not like yearning, like hope for like, it's not that kind of wish. It's not wish.

No, it is that nitty gritty. This is gonna work like this is gonna work. This works.
It's the backbone. What they've got is a trust backbone, right? And you know, you know that. Okay, so the spine is supple, right? And that's what they share. They share a supple spine of trust well, and that is the and I think what you get to do, what I get to do, is bring them back to that when they wander off, right? When they forget this is going to work, and I know how to do this, yeah, over and over and over and over and over. And that's the work of grounding, right? It is the coming back to center when they're like, Wait, is this going to work? Like, yes, this is going to work. And I know how to do this over and over and over and over again, because that's the center, isn't it, right? This is going to work. And I know how to do this. 

And the expertise I have is not is worth more than $5 my friends like, that is the truth of it. Like, I like, I say to people all the time, we work in three digit numbers here. Yeah, yeah, we work in three digit numbers. So give me a number with three digits. You can pick the littlest one if you like, but give me a number with three digits. Like, I can't be playing with this. We're not trying to, like, $5 No.
Okay, so I love that for so many reasons. And one of my favorite reasons is people don't realize how much they devalue other people when they charge too low price. And it's something I really noticed when I was supporting product based businesses, you know, traditional crafts, textiles, that kind of stuff, right? And you would have a hobbyist, yep, sell items that, you know, were beautiful at such a low value that actual genuine artisans were, you know, shamed and, you know, being, you know, called out and then called, like, for for charging way too much for absolutely appropriately priced items. Yeah, yeah. So it's, you know, hey, like, do you know that you're actually damaging the credibility of genuine artisans by not valuing yourself well?

And I think in addition to that, the thing I remind people all the time is that you as a consumer, when someone does something really well for you, you want to pay them, and when they're like, you feel weird because you want to value them and you want to pay them a price. Appropriately, when somebody's like, Oh, it's just like, $10 you're like, nope, nope, we're not going to do this. Like, you're being ridiculous. That works in reverse. People want to pay you, yeah, right. And when you don't give them the opportunity, you are deciding what they get to do with their money. And, like, that's not how this works. I don't like people tell me what
to do. So I think two things about that. I think, one, you've created your life beautifully to not find those people because they they're out there. Oh no, I know there are definitely people that don't want to play. And I think, again, that's that's a testimony to you. And again, what a lovely example to set to your community. Right?

But like as a business owner, I want to we have a lovely I think of him as 18 still, because that's how old he was when he started caring for our dogs. But he is now like a grown up with multiple businesses and a boarding facility and training and all these things. And I will come in to pay for something, and he'll be like first client discount. I will discount. I will be like, you will knock it off. Because, literally, we were his first clients 10 years ago, right? The kids were babies. And he'll be like, first client discount. And I'll be like, You are killing me right now. I love you. Knock it off. And he will laugh and do it anyways. But like, every time I'm like, we're going to fight about this, dang it.

You know, I literally had to have that exact conversation with with my kids here, who we were the first clients, right? And it was, it was a big deal. And the last, the last situation I had, I was like, I'm only going to allow you to give me a discount on one session a week because we have multiple sessions, I'm not, I'm not going to personally allow correct, like, this is multiple sessions, but I will concede to one distress, right? Like I will not concede to six discounts when I'm doing
that absolute nonsense. Yes, agreed so. But what is if you have people walking away thinking about one particular thing related to trust, what is it?
Accurate? Yourself, back yourself, despite whatever voice is telling you that you are inherently untrustworthy for yourself,I feel like I should just hit stop. Boom. Right.   

Like, can you imagine? Like I want if you're listening to this, I want you to like, pause, even if you're out walking the dog, which I am all the time, and I do randomly stop in the street. So join the club, like, pause for a second and imagine what business is like, what success is like, what day to day is like. If you decide the messages inside of you are trustworthy, that you are trustworthy, and you decide to back yourself unconditionally, like imagine, then play it out. What changes? What do you do? What do you not do? Who do you listen to? Who do you not listen to? Where does your time go? Where does your money go? Right? Where does your space go? What do you not tolerate anymore? So many things, right. What kind of business grows out of that? That versus the constant trying to make it right for everybody except you? Yeah, make sure you're not standing in the street where cars are coming.

I think the wall could be a different place.
Seriously, though, can you imagine, this is the magic, this is the magic you get to do with people. It makes me so happy to see your face. My friend. Tell people how to find you and tell them about the freebie, which I will link because I have the link to it.

Yes, yes, yes. That's amazing. So you can find me at make and keep money.com. That's make and keep a Eep money.com. Yes, ma'am, when I, when I do that, it's, it always comes up with some kind of weird sort of, like, I don't speak clearly enough. So I'm, like, really trying to make sure I say things clearly. Yeah, I
makes it a whole different thing. Sometimes it's like, when you are. To auto correct in your phone. You're like, those were not the words I use. I don't know what
you're talking about. I've been doing that all day. I've been editing a video day, and it's and you're like, Wait, who's Oscar? What? What happened? All right, tell them. Tell them the other things.

Okay, so you've got your go to price increase strategy, and you've got the, you've got the link for that, and you know, there are, there's lots of, like, kind of bogus advice out there about how to raise your prices. And what I've tried to put together in this guide is a really nuanced guide to to do it, maybe even to not do it, because it's not always right. Yep, fair, not always right. And, and I think that is a really important conversation, which for another day. But if, if, if it is the right time to do it, how can we do it in a way that serves you and your client, you know, and including, I've put scripts in there. I've put different, you know, kind of like a 30 day process, because, you know, again, I work with people who are heart centered, who care so deeply, and to do it in a way that if, if it feels like it, they're cutting off their arm, the shock is too harmful. It doesn't do anyone any it doesn't do that clients, any good. It doesn't do many, yeah, well, and it takes some
even for me, when I think about raising my own prices or changing things, I probably think about it for three or four months before I do it. It takes me a while to wrap my brain around it and feel like sometimes you have to, like, walk around the backyard and practice having the words come out of your face, because, like, You got to be able to say the number, right? And that's like, the number of times that I'm in the car that I'm, like, using the number out loud in the car because I'm in the car alone. Like, thank God that we can connect to phones in our car now, and people just don't think I'm a lunatic. Well, like, again, one of the things that, you   know, I go through with my clients is, you know, saying your prices should be like, you know, someone says, what, what day of the week is it? Or what's the time? Yep, and you just say, hey, it's Tuesday and it's 240 and that's and it's $300.03
digit numbers, right?

And it, it, it can take some time to get there, but I have not had my person that had got there, right? Yep, no. And so yeah, it's always that way. Oh, my friend, what a delight it is to have you. Thank you so much for coming to play with us. Friends. I am Sara. If you are not in my Facebook group, it is called uncomplicating business, just like this podcast. By the time this comes out, the dog is barking, pardon her. There are dog walkers just came, speaking of people I adore. There will be something new coming in my world called the uncomplicated Business Lab, and you should come play with us. I'm not going to tell you more than that yet, because I'm still detailing in the background, and we're recording this ahead of that, so we'll get there, but come check it out, and we'll see you all the places also before we go.

 You know, I say this every time, but my friend Georgia is a real human being. You could go to LinkedIn or the Facebook or all the places she is and like, connect to her and actually have a whole human conversation, as you have just heard, she's a freaking delight, and you will love her. And I could listen to her talk all day. So please be like, Oh, it's a human. I'm a human. Let's connect. Don't be afraid like she's great, okay, okay.